Another “what do you think?”

I saw this this morning while my mom was getting her chemo. I came home and looked it up because I thought it might make for a good discussion. I’m not sure we’ve ever talked about this here. I’ll save what I think until after a few of you voice your opinion.

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11 Responses to Another “what do you think?”

  1. Laura says:

    What a mess…
    My first reaction is that we’re using the “Free Speech” card a little too much. I agree that everyone has the right to say what they want, and that there is no “right” to not be offended, however… It seems like it’s perfectly ok to abridge someone’s “free speech” in some cases (religion) and not in others (Westboro). I also thought that the Freedom of Speech clause applied only in cases of political speech – it protected you from persecution for saying that the ‘king is a fink’ kind of a thing. But now, it’s being expanded to say that anybody can say anything, even something harmful, to or about anyone else, and it’s their “protected right”. I don’t know what the answer is there. I certainly wouldn’t want to see people arrested for saying stupid things (as much as I might say so).

    My second issue is this… had this guy left the woman at the altar, pregnant and crying, and she took out a billboard on him, saying what a pathetic jerk he was, she’d be held up as a heroine, a strong woman who was sticking it to her conniving, dirty rotten jerk of a boyfriend. Assuming she did have an abortion without his “consent”, why would this be any different? Of course, there is such a double standard in this country. Suddenly a baby that two people make becomes “her body” and he has no say, whatsoever.

    For the record, I don’t agree with what he did. I think this was a matter that should have been kept between the two of them. And I’d say that if she was the jilted one taking out the billboard on him.

  2. SKL says:

    This is how I see it. This man has declared himself the “poster child” for something that is a real problem in our country. This really isn’t about the individual mom at all, and besides, only a handful of people would even know she was the “mother” he was talking about. And as for those people, if he wanted to smear her in front of them, he could have done it for free with an email, phone calls, whetever. So no, I don’t think this is about her. It’s about fathers’ rights when they want their baby to live.

    There’s no justifying the complete imbalance of rights when it comes to pregnancies that are not wanted by both parents. If the woman wanted to bear and raise a live child and the dad fed her a substance that forced a miscarriage, who would rush to this man’s defense? Not one human. So he would have to defer to her choice to bear the child. If she decided to parent (as opposed to relinquishing for adoption), she would force him to support the child for 18+ years, even if she lied about being fertile and knew he never wanted a child. And by the way, deadbeat dads are publicly humiliated by name routinely. Yet if the dad dearly desired to see his child born and/or to parent the child, it doesn’t matter one whit. The mom can have an abortion and parade it in front of his face if she wants to. On another site, many women were commenting “who cares if she had an abortion” and “it’s nobody’s business.” Of course it’s the father’s business. What a horrible thing to do.

    Whether or not this particular man is a nice guy, that should not matter. We all know that this happens to decent guys all the time. And it hurts. And that is this man’s message. A: consider how the bereaved father feels after an abortion he didn’t agree with. And B: be very, very careful who you sleep with if you don’t want to see your offspring ground up and dumped like moldy potatoes in a trash compactor. Don’t create a life if you can’t bear to see it end that way, unless you’re sure of the woman’s commitment to life.

    Women have been celebrated for making themselves “poster children” by publicly trashing their parents, ex-husbands, employers, and on and on. Never before have I heard anyone argue that you can’t go public about a hurtful private matter. What’s the difference here? The difference is that the very large abortion industry has gotten behind this woman.

    So if you’re a man, once again, no matter what went wrong, it’s your fault. I’m sure you’re already used to that.

  3. Ellen says:

    To me, this is too sick for words. What an idiot to make that bill board. This is a privacy matter, not a public one. Do not make it our problem. It may sound cold, but I think what he did is insane. Why is it okay to trash publicly your parents, ex-husbands, ex-wifes etc.? I do not want to be bothered by that either. I would think this is not a news item, these stories should be ignored. Then it might stop one day.

  4. Phyllis says:

    This is an extreme reaction on the man’s part to an extreme action on the woman’s part. Yes, he’s put a picture of himself on a public billboard, but it is a picture of HIMSELF. It’s not a pic of the woman. Neither his name nor hers is listed anywhere on the billboard. It doesn’t reveal anything that would be covered by Heppa. Is this billboard really any different than any others that advertise products but use professional models to promote them? Is this any different than the signs we all see that promote planned parenthood, abortion clinics, hospitals, or paternity testing? I don’t think so, but that’s just my opinion. Is it covered by the freedom of speech card? I’m not sure, but if all the other billboards (and commercials on t.v.) are then I guess it is. However, I believe (like others here), that this freedom is often being abused and trotted out when it shouldn’t be.

    Yes, perhaps the billboard will be seen by countless people over a period of time, but no one passing by, except those who know the man personally, will have any idea that it’s anything but an pro-life advertisement. Does the woman find it embarrassing? I’m sure she does, especially if she did (as her lawyer states) suffer a miscarriage rather than opting for an abortion. Either way the experience has affected her life forever and either way it is sad.

    Should she decide to retaliate in a public forum we could very well be seeing her on Maury or Jerry Springer sometime in the future. This whole thing is a fiasco! If she does go to court her anonymity will be shot and only call even more attention to her. So, I have to question the wisdom of that if the issue is really one of privacy.

  5. Sue says:

    Well, my initial reaction was that it totally violated her privacy, but then I read Phyllis’s comment and that sounded accurate so I looked up the HIPAA rules/reg’s to see what it said. They kind of surprised me because I thought your medical info was private no matter what (b/c I work in a hospital and it’s drilled in your head that you can’t say boo about anything to anybody!) but that’s not the case. Here’s the link if you want to read all the tabs for yourself.
    http://www.hhs.gov/ocr/privacy/hipaa/understanding/consumers/index.html
    Here’s a couple of exerts for those who don’t want to read! LOL!
    Who Must Follow These Laws:

    We call the entities that must follow the HIPAA regulations covered entities.

    Covered entities include:

    Health Plans, including health insurance companies, HMOs, company health plans, and certain government programs that pay for health care, such as Medicare and Medicaid.

    Most Health Care Providers—those that conduct certain business electronically, such as electronically billing your health insurance—including most doctors, clinics, hospitals, psychologists, chiropractors, nursing homes, pharmacies, and dentists.

    Health Care Clearinghouses—entities that process nonstandard health information they receive from another entity into a standard (i.e., standard electronic format or data content), or vice versa.

    Who Is NOT Required to Follow These Laws:

    Many organizations that have health information about you do not have to follow these laws.

    Examples of organizations that do not have to follow the Privacy and Security Rules include:

    life insurers,
    employers,
    workers compensation carriers,
    many schools and school districts,
    many state agencies like child protective service agencies,
    many law enforcement agencies,
    many municipal offices.

    So, based off of that information, this doesn’t violate her right to privacy. It’s extremely distasteful and disrespectful and I think it makes him look like an ass, but Phyllis is right. It doesn’t identify her in any way so unless you know either mom or dad, you’re not going to know who it is. (I’m guessing though they live in a smaller community where everyone knows who the billboard is about anyway.) It’s a crazy situation, that’s for sure!

    • Phyllis says:

      Just to be clear on my comment…. I heartily agree that this was done in the poorest of taste! And I, too, believe it wasn’t the best way to address the situation. However it isn’t a violation of her privacy as far as I can tell.

  6. SKL says:

    I noticed that in the linked story, the man’s attorney sounded quite sure that the woman actually had an abortion, while the woman’s attorney indicated that she didn’t ask the woman whether it was true or not. Hmm. Obviously if it was a miscarriage, that is sadder than sad. But I still think the message on this billboard (about fathers’ rights in general) is a message people should hear.

  7. Nikki says:

    I do feel that fathers of unborn children should have rights. However, I do not agree with the billboard. I think it was in extremely poor taste. There are other ways of going about it.

    If a billboard is what gets the issue at hand out there…do that. But don’t put your face on it. I think it could have been done in a much more tasteful way. I do think the message needs to be heard, and the rights of fathers needs to be addressed. Women’s/Mothers rights are in your face all the time. Why shouldn’t there be some kind of campaign for fathers’ rights? But make it about the issue, not YOU!

  8. Joy says:

    Boy, talk about an ADD morning. I sat down to write this at 8:00 and not it’s 10:10!!!!!

    Well, I know this is a hard one. My first reaction is that I tend to think about what SKL pointed out “mostly.” That is the man’s right to making a decision in matters like this. Yes, as a woman, I know it falls mostly on the woman but not mainly.There are a LOT of men out there raising families as a single parent.

    I honestly would like it if you only slept with people you loved. Then I’m sure this wouldn’t be such an issue. But I do feel for men who’s “women” abort a child they really want. It’s not like a man who really doesn’t want a child “right now” can do anything. He can’t make her get an abortion so I really find that unfair.

    As far as this story, I kind of think this is a goof ball couple in the first place. BUT….This man was hurt. He never once mentioned his or her name so I’m wondering how she can think he abused her privacy? If I saw that I’d think it a anti abortion billboard. But, anyone who knew them could add it up. Still, abortion or miscarriages hurt. Neither is a fun thing or an easy decision. I’d personally never have an abortion and I’d be devastated if either of my daughter in laws had one, I do think if for whatever reason a woman finds herself in the position to get one, she should be able to under good doctors care. I can’t preach holier and though stuff about what God says because I don’t even go to church and it’s one of my peeves if people use God or the Bible as a reference to something and they haven’t been to church in 25 years.

    So now that I was ALL OVER the place. I don’t think this man broke the law. If the woman had a miscarriage, I’m sorry. If she had an abortion KNOWING her boyfriend wanted that child, SHAME ON HER.

  9. SKL says:

    I wish some of the guys would share their perspective.

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